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Ginger Thomas 2004 email icqEnough is enough07-18-2001
Two Harbors has for a long time now, been fighting for a new school. I am of the school and am in it almost all year round.

It is time that the teens take this situation to their advantage. I can tell you all over and over again what is wrong and what is right with it. But that doesn't help if you can only read the words and never see it. but since I can right better than I can give a visual sense, this will do.

I will right again, as to be sure that this is a promise. For enough is enough. It's time for the teens to fight for the right of a new school too.



Drifter email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Ginger - You are 100% correct. Keep fighting for what you believe in. People need to take a look at their priorities and look to the future, and realize they must pay more for schools than they currently are. The free ride is over. Too many people spend their time not looking at the big picture and are just worried about how much their silly rebate check will be this year. Unfortunately, I have been away from TH for almost 20 years, so there's not a lot I can do. But you can. Keep fighting!



Tim email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Yes Ginger, you need a new school. One where basic English composition is taught.



Drifter email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Easy to throw out a cheap shot, isn't it Tim?



Danny email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
I think the Vikings will be strong again. The rest of the group have not improved that much. Tampa Bay just adds 10 or 12 players each year. They can only play one or two, so its a wate of time. Detroit is a big loser. Chicago is last place. And the Packers. When Farve gets hurt, it is all over. So the Vikings will win it all. I thank you.



Baker email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
I'm glad you're back! I was wondering where you were.



Captain America email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Hey Ginger, how are Bill and Paulie these days? I used to work with them back at the Harbor House in times past...Oh, and btw, you "write" words, you "right" an injustice...



School email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
I done lernt ta right ril good at THS. Them folks what thinks we needs a new school is all dum. I cain't give no visual sense.



Fritz email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Yea Tim, give the kid a break. Did any of the reunions you guys have been talking about include a tour of the school? Any personal comments about the condition of the school you can relate?



Nugget email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Fritz, I believe I can paint something of a visual and even satisfy the likes of Tim. The school itself is listing to port and is no longer secure on its foundation. As a result, doors no longer close as their frames are no longer square. The ceiling is falling in more than a few rooms, and the bandroom has been condemed due to numerous code violations. Janitorial services have been cut and the school was quite dirty when I was there a year ago. The list could go on and on, but I believe it is no longer a safe building and it ought to be replaced. Certainly these kids deserve a building that is safe and clean and offers access to the new technologies with which they will be working in the coming years. As for Tim, I have two thoughts. First, find a copy of Thomas Jefferson's original writing of the Declaration of Independence. You will find it full of mis-spelled words and grammatical errors. You will also find is full of ideas and concepts that created a nation where all are free to express their ideas. Second, your message would have been much stronger with a well-placed semicolon instead of using two sentences. Something about glass houses comes to mind...



happy email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
You tell him, Nugget!



webman email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Welcome Ginger,

I am glad you found us. Speak up and let your voice be heard! You go girl!



Ginger Thomas email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Look, I was in the english Grammer comp class and don't tell me that you have NEVER messed up on spelling.

Nugget is completely correct about the high school and in truth, the high school has not gotten any better. It's worse.

This year, we had to close that bandroom, and not too many months later, we had a pipe break down in the tunnel leading to the bandroom, letting water flood the tunnel and making it even harder to access. Now, we are spending money repairing and adding new things to a school that has just plain wore itself out. There is no more too it. It's falling apart and the money we spent repairing it could easily build a new school with the help of the state.

My mother and father if not known by some (and it is not by many) are divorced and my mother is remarried and lives and Duluth and my father is a Bartender at Grand Superior Lodge.



Bassman email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Drifter, You said that you have been away from T.H. for 20 years and there is not much you can do. If you get the T.H. paper, as most of us who left do, you may have seen the article a couple of months back about contributing to a fund to help the school. You don't have to leave in T.H. to do that, so if you are concerned, put your donation where your mouth is!!!!

For those of you that think Giles (Bucko) Anderson is a "A", then you don't know him that well.



Bassman email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
P.S. Nugget, If as you say that the school is leaning to Port, which is LEFT, then the school should be re-built and maybe the students will find out about Starboard, the RIGHT, but I don't know who would teach that side of things in T.H.



Drifter email icqRe: Enough is enough07-18-2001
Bassman - I do not receive the Chronicle, but I guess my point was that I can't do much about trying to convince people in TH that a new school might be in their best interest since I am far removed from the town. I support new schools and new opportunities for the kids in the city I live in now, and I believe it would also be a good investment for the people of Two Harbors. They will have to decide their own fate, not me.



california email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
I took a small tour of the school, and spent time in pool stands watching a class with friends. As I walked the halls that I left 20 years ago, there was nothing different, only weathered.

Does a new school make smarter kids?...mabye not, but its the first thing I look at in the town I plan to live in and pay taxes in. K-12 schools are very important to the economy of the town, and T.H.,in the long run would profit in a new H.S.

Has anyone taken a poll of the kids

enrolled in the school, I would bet there isn't one vote to keep it standing.

Ginger and "The Drifter" have good attitudes.



Bassman email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Drifter, Well, you could write a letter to the editor of the T.H. paper and express you opinion and asked it to be published or even ask him about the article he wrote about donating to the school fund. That way you could write a check in whatever amount you think you could afford and would help the local school, or you can just keep on writing about how there is nothing you can do and do just that!!!!!!!!! Bullshit talks and money talks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



TWC email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Bassman, please back off a little.

Since when did it become Drifter's responsibiity to get a school built? He could write checks from now until hell freezes over, and that wouldn't be enough. Ultimately, the decision to build, remodel or do nothing remains with the residents of the school district. Their tax dollars and their children are the issues here.

Can non-residents and/or alumni exert influence at all? To some extent, we can lobby and donate. Again, though, any "outside" funds or political pressure could create a backlash of sorts, for the simple reason that opponents of a new school could point to the fact that non-residents don't have to pay for it.

If you truly feel passionate about the issue, Bassman (and it seems you do), I would direct that passion at the people who believe THHS is good enough now, because it was good enough 40 years ago. Their minds must be changed, not ours.



Drifter email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Bassman - Wonderful idea. I will consider it. Perhaps you could even draft up the letter that you feel I should send to the editor of the Chronicle. Now I don't think we've heard your views of the issue, just compaints and suggestions for what you feel others should do.



Nugget email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
You know what gets to me on this issue? It looks as though it has been dead in the water for a couple of years now. No movement in either direction. I can't understand this inability to decide. The costs of either fixing the exisiting building or replacing it continue to escalate while both sides seem to get more and more entrenched and nothing gets done. California, I agree that a new school does not automatically mean smarter kids. But clearly how a community feels about the education opportunities of its youngest citizens reveals much about that community. (In addition, as long as the State mandates that children attend school until a certain age, it becomes incumbent upon the State, working with the local community, to provide an adequate setting. Reasonable people can disagree on a definition of 'adequate', but in my humble opinion, that building falls short in adequacy AND safety). Two Harbors can draw tourists til the last tourist dollar hits the last cash register, but ultimately, as California mentioned, families considering moving to TH (and young families are the lifeblood of small communities) are going to look at the school as a major consideration of living there. And I think that is the crux of the problem. Many in TH do not want new families moving in. They want things to be the way they are, or once were. Its an attitude of "Don't raise MY taxes to create education dollars for THEIR kids". Sad. But equally true.



Kitty email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Bassman, TWC is right, back off. We practice something called bulletin board etiquette here.

Nugget, you're right on, bro. And California, your 2nd paragraph is so true, and a new school will DRAW people to Two Harbors.

Ginger, I'm really sorry about your parents split. Hang in there, kiddo.

My suggestion to you is to get your friends together and get petitions going...have everyone and their brother sign them, and when you've got a couple hundred names (check them out to make sure you've no repeats and the ones who've signed are actually living in the school district) bring it to the next school board meeting. There's nothing like a group of organized students crashing a board meeting to get their attention, and hopefully, after you've demanded an inspection of the building, a millage for a new school will be put to a vote. If you get that far, ask that the vote be in January when all the snow birds who'd vote no will be in sunny Florida.

Hey, it worked in this school district!



Garth email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Bassman, better layoff ripping the Drifter. He's a legend out here and has friends in high places. I do agree with you about Giles...good guy and he can swing the sticks like a son of a bitch.



Kitty email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Ginger, a correction on my last post: don't demand an inspection, ask nicely for one. I just got carried away a bit.



Postman email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
I liked it better when we talked about beer.



Pond Boys email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Who is Giles? Didn't he play for the North Stars? Sad about the school



Fritz email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Bassman: I think 24 years in the Navy makes me an expert on Port and Starboard. If any thing is "Listing to Port" on this BB it's you. You seem to have some real issues. To the cooler HEADS: (south shore included) do they have a site picked out for a new school, if they build it?



Captain America email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
If enought alumni send in $20 to the school board, would a new THHS get built??? No. Sad as it is to say, the decision must be made by the residents.

Fritz, there are a couple of sites being bandied about for a new school. The Nahau site was selected by a blue ribbon panel a couple years ago. All the work of this panel was printed faithfully in the Chronicle each week, only to be ignored by the public who claimed "conspiricy theories" and "hidden agendas" existed in the referendum effort.

A 2nd site called the HEART project is proposed near the current Clinic adjacent to the golf course. That is a fairly disruptive, although otherwise clever idea put forth by the city planner. His idea, which has merit, is to place the school in town and make it the center of the community.

I worked at the THHS golf course for 3 summers. A particular group of players led by Giles Anderson made it their personal agenda to bitch, whine and complain about the course every time I saw them. I didn't need 4 old men screaming and swearing at me as an 18 year old city employee. Giles, Beano Rosatti, Butch-o Kolberg and Bruce-o Jordan are pricks who can go to hell as far as I'm concerned. If Giles has any redeeming values to him that others have encountered, then great. I just hadn't seen any of them in the 15 years that I reguarly played golf at the THHS course. He's an asshole. Or the whole ass, however you look at it.



Lana T. email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Postman, I'm still waiting for you to ring the second time....



Nugget email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Hey Captain, doesn't the HEART project proposal eat up a couple of holes on the golf course that would then have to be rebuilt?



Fred email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Nugget, I hope you don't mind me fielding the question on the HEART project. Yes, the current proposal does use up to 4 current holes on the course, although no blueprints or definite plans have been laid out as far as I know..just conceptual ideas. They are looking at approx. 53 acres of golf course land, and the District currently owns approx. 72 acres at the Nauha site.



Nugget email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Fred, thanks for the info. That certainly has to increase the opposition as they just finished the course, didn't they?



Former Res email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
It will be tough for a new school to be built in TH. TH is not the same place it used to be. The job base is not there. Also missing is the a sense of community pride aimed towards kids, no support whatsoever. If you go to a high school sporting or academic event, there is no one there. To me it shows that a large part of TH does not care what the kids are doing. If you think about it, if it weren't for the schools activities, what would these kids do? Yes there are some die hard supporters of THHS, but they are in the minority.

I am finding TH to be a place where 'bitching and bickering' are becoming the norm. Locals, like Captain talked about are too busy bitching about an increase in golf fees, instead of complimenting how great the course has become. Or individuals complaining about development, because it does not benefit them.

I hope a new school is built, but I am not counting on it.....



Drifter email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Fred, I believe you're living in TH. What's the mood up there? When will the next vote take place? Will it pass this time? Will it ever pass?



Trixie email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
That damn Drifter was gonna pay me with a check and it bounced, TWC is right, it's not the Drifter's problem, the next round at Hugo's is his problem though!



Skipper email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
The bigger problem is what the hell happened to Torg, does someone have to tell him the 4th of July parade is over, there are no more floats....



Giles email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Now that I have figured out who that little bastard Captain America is, my foursome can go to the Cities and kick his smart little beer-swilling ass.



webman email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Damn, I love these discussions. They bring out the best writers. You folks continue to amaze me with your well thought-out and well written opinion pieces. Maybe we should collect some of the best ones from this thread and some of the old ones and send them to Forrest Johnson at the TH news rag.

Torggy, where are you?



Jesse V. (The Mind) email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
You guys better leave my friend Bassman alone!!! If Drifter has people in high places, just how high do you want to go! And if you want to go higher than me, I got news for you because Geo. W. is a personal friend of mine!!!!!!!!



Natasha Fatale email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
I say vote Moose and Squirel onto the Board of Education--they'll get the job done. Look what they did for Frostbite Falls, MN



Drifter email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
Garth, didn't you sing a (stolen) song about friends in low places, or are you another Garth? I take exception to your statement, because I know for a fact that I have very few friends, and they are all cheap beer guzzling, tobacco chewing, soiled tee-shirt wearing, multiple-Mulligan taking, ass smelling losers. And they will NEVER buy a round of 3.2 plastic cup beers at Hugo's. Skipper once offered me a pickled egg at Hugo's. I refused, and Ivan choked 'er down. He said it was rather "rubbery", but with enough of said beverage, she went down.



Steven Bonewhacker (Chief of Staff) email icqRe: Enough is enough07-19-2001
I never knew the sexy Guv knew Geo Washington. I admire him even more!!! Oh, those biceps.



Bassman email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
Boy you shake the tree a little and it is amazing what falls out!!

Thanks Jesse, but I won't need to call on your help, I can handle this myself.

Kitty, Your speaking to me about etiquette, maybe you should scroll up and read Captain America's reply regarding Giles Anderson and send the message to him on etiquette. I realize this is an uncensored forum, but some peoples true personalities do seem to come out don't they.

Captain America, What if all the living alumni of T.H. sent in $100.00 or even $1,000.00, how much would that be?? I bet enough to make a difference.

Drifter, The people in T.H. that are in the majority are the elderly and I don't blame them for not wanting their taxes to go up while on fixed incomes. And there is not enough young parents to pass a school bond. I doubt it will ever get done and so they will keep spending money in trying to fix the school. Like pouring money down the drain. Something has to be done if the young kids in T.H. are ever going to have a decent school to go to and get an education in. I am sure that if the word could get out to all the alumni that there would be a good response. One other choice is for the young parents in town to home school their kids, but that takes a lot of time and dedication on their part and not everyone has the time or education to do so.

Fritz, I am definitely not on the Left of anything, unless it's on my bass boat bringing in a bass. I am right, (Starboard for you), of center on the political side of things. Though raised in T.H. and with DFL parents, that soon changed when I got out in the real world. And for your info, I did sent in a very good contribution for the voluntary school fund.

Hope this takes some of the fire out of those who think I was just trying to tell others what to do and don't have any suggestions of my own.



Ginger Thomas email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
You are all right, see, what you have all said is exactly what is happening right now with the school.

You know, teachers and parents have asked each and everyone of the students to care of the school but what is the point of taking care of a school that is falling apart? But there again is another side for the parents, teachers and the elderly. the question of, "What is the point of building a new school if they can't take care of the one they have now?"

We have. Students AND teachers have spent part of every school vacation updating and repairing parts of the school. Taking time off of there hectic lives to see that our school is as best as it can be. But that moment has passed. Things just have to be kept being done over and OVER again.

So for the question above here is the answer

"Ladies and Gentlemen, we will take care of the new school, because it IS something to take care of and be proud of too."

And just for Tim....

My own little "inproper" ending.

"nuff said"



Bassman email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
Ginger, Hang in there, you are one fine person. I only wish that I was as rich as Bill Gates and I would build you a new school. In the mean time all I can do is try to support a New T.H.H.S. with a donation every now and then.



Torggy email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
I am right here guys. There are just not enough hours in the day to go around right now. Has it really been since the 4th that I have posted? It is midnight as I write this and a early morning ahead. Boo-Hoo. So much for the whining part.

One of the things that always seems to come up when ever any one talks about the TH high school is how dirty it is, what a sad state of repair it is in and how unsafe it is for the students. How long before the powers in control cut back on services and the new building is dirty, unrepaired and unsafe? Many of the people I have talked to in Th have expressed frustration over this matter. There are other buildings in the district, what kind of shape are they in? If they are also dirty, unrepaired and unsafe then we must consider that. Teachers, students and parents can not take care of a school by on again off again work parties. The intent is great but a large building like that needs constant attention. So would a new one. It seems to always come back to an answer that the majority in TH are not willing to accept. Must be time for other ideas. I know I have not put forth any answers except maybe the school board needs new blood and a new direction.

Bassman; I agree, the real world can be an eye opener to a DFL kid from TH. I must also profess to a right side of the spectrum stance.



Fritz email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
This could be a whole new thread. What does being to the right or left of a subject being discussed have to do with the matter at hand? Is there a left and right anymore? How far left is left? How far right is right? Are Republicans just Democrats in better suits? I think so. How do you feel?



Ernest Talupa email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
"Pair a choppers."



Garth email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
Some people call me Combo.



Spicoli email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
I think Mr. Hand should interject?



C.Halsted email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
Please take my name off that joke of a field!



Kitty email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
Bassman, the reason I never commented on Captains post of Giles Anderson, is because I do not know if Giles is or is not a jerk. I do know, however, Captain is a nice guy and usually doesn't post so negatively, so I figured he had a reason to post as he did. You, on the other hand, have been posting negatively from the get go. And if my memory serves me correctly, aren't you the one who said I was "one of the guys"? That is enough to ruffle my feathers. By the way, I don't believe you've said where you're posting from, and I, for one, would like to know. And I believe Two Harbors is as much a part of the real world as anywhere else in this free country of ours. Just because it's small doesn't mean it isn't real....I shall say no more on size...



Captain America email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
Yes Bassman, I whole-heartedly agree that that if every living alumni gave $100 or $1000, that would make a difference. Maybe that is the only real end result that matters...but I'm reminded of the parable about "give a man a fish he eats today, teach a man to fish..."

If the people of TH are handed a new school that they don't have to contribute for or work on, will there be a community pride or sense of accomplishment? I don't have the answer for that. The townspeople will probably still just find something to bitch about...

I have to agree whole-heartedly with Former Res--the townspeople of TH would rather bitch than actually do something (present company excluded, of course.)

But, on a more positive note, maybe the Arbleys could all send a donation to Webman and he/she could forward the $$ and some of our threads onto the Lake County Comical as a donation to the school effort?

We could all try to be part of the solution then, like the Bassman.



Nugget email icqRe: Enough is enough07-20-2001
Fritz, I for one agree...its a great topic, and would be a fun thread. An oversimplification might say that on the education issue, Republicans might argue that the TH situation is local, while a Democrat might argue that its a state issue as much as it is a local issue. Republicans might argue that kids ought to get vouchers to carry to private schools and the competition those vouchers create might shake up local school boards, the teacher's unions and Democrats that just want to spend more uncontrolled $ in schools, while Democrats might argue that vouchers will destroy a good public schools system, do nothing to help kids who are unprepared for the 'rigors' of private schools and who lack the funds to supplement that voucher, and that the teacher's unions have the best interest of the kids in mind. Republicans might argue that had those Seniors on fixed incomes been able to control their retirement instead of relying of the government's low return on social security deposits those same seniors would have more income now. Democrats might argue that those same seniors, as citizens, might have the same responsibility to help those that come after them as they received from those that came before. That list goes on and that's an oversimplification and as usual I suspect that the truth lies somewhere in the middle. Welcome back Torggy. You and I, while not sitting on the same spot on the spectrum, can at least see each other but you'll have to look to your left to find me...



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